What do you think about the Ribbon?

[lacastle]

Also, someone mentioned the style presets--why can't I put my corporate styles there? And why isn't there a style reset there?

Kevin,
This doesn't really have anything to do with Flare anymore, but it is possible to put your corporate styles in the style box. You just have to click the Manage Styles icon in the Styles bar and Import your styles into the Normal template so they'll display with a new document. Also on the Styles bar is a Clear All for clearing the formatting.

[KevinDAmery]

Also, someone mentioned the style presets--why can't I put my corporate styles there? And why isn't there a style reset there?

Kevin,
This doesn't really have anything to do with Flare anymore, but it is possible to put your corporate styles in the style box. You just have to click the Manage Styles icon in the Styles bar and Import your styles into the Normal template so they'll display with a new document.

I can manage .DOT files fine--but does that put them in the ribbon is the question? Putting them in the styles box (like in Word 2003 and earlier) isn't the issue.

It gets better: we have three different .DOT files that we use, depending on the purpose of the document (different colour schemes depending on whether it's a technical document or a marketting document). That flexibility is precisely why Word supports multiple .DOT files and the ability to attach them to a document. But if ONLY the styles in Normal.Dot appear in the ribbon, it kills that flexibility. Microsquish seems to want all new Word documents to look like the styles they like in Redmond.

Again, I'm not averse to the concept of the ribbon (I like the idea of having tools swap in and out depending on what you're doing) but in order to be really workable you have to be able to customize which tools are in which toolboxes. As it is, it seems to be a one-size-fits-all implementation, and the one-size seems to be chosen for M$'s conception of the lowest common denominator.

So to bring it back to Flare, I'm not against Flare having a ribbon, but PLEASE make any new UI changes actually work for us (and preferably be customizable). The styles should come from my stylesheet, not from some common list of presets, the tools in each ribbon should be definable by the writer, etc. In short, Madcap shouldn't be deciding how I work. (And in fairness, Madcap has been doing that well so far--it's just that the implementations of the ribbon to date have not, so I'd hate to see Madcap fall into that trap.)

[KevinDAmery]

What I love to see as an improvement in the Flare GUI is to have the scroll wheel work in the style list (in any list for that matter). The scroll wheel is a good invention that makes accessing listed items much quicker.

Absotively posilutely

[jossch]

I'm not as "techy" as the rest of you sound, but I *was* considered a Word Guru in my circle of collegues. With this new version, I haven't the foggiest of how to access half of the stuff that made life with MS Word bareable. It took me HOURS to figure out that I needed to click the icon in the upper left corner to get a save/open, etc. drop-down menu. The only reason I figured that out is my "techy" hubby told me. He laughed and lauged at me on that one. The only reason I upgraded was because he made me, otherwise, I would still be in my blissfully easy to use, well-known world. I'm not typically one to flinch at change, but this is just a pain! All the wasted time to learn how to do something that you used to be able to do in 2 seconds with well-known menus and shortcut keys!

Just some thoughts for those riding the "what's hot" bandwagon.

Josette

[LTinker68]

It took me HOURS to figure out that I needed to click the icon in the upper left corner to get a save/open, etc. drop-down menu.

Just out of curiosity (since I don't have Word 2007 and I'm holding off on the upgrade as long as possible), did the Word help tell you where to go to get that menu, or are they still just describing what save does but not how to go about getting to the save menu?

[Fedja]

I'm not as "techy" as the rest of you sound...

First of all, do let me know if your marriage falls though someday and I'll propose. I hope you don't mind me adopting that statement for the occasional office snipe, it's sheer brilliance in a can.

Regarding the rest of your post, I'd like to point you to the F1 button on your keyboard, in the top left corner, specifically. Those of us that spend the better part of our day writing what pops up when you press it get so sad reading what you wrote. As far as fundamental changes to the UI go, the playing field in the office does level to some extent. Those willing to learn get the edge back soon, and once again spend half of their day answering phone calls from coworkers and grunting the good ole RTFM after hanging up.

The difference between those of us that "sound techy" and the "rest" is not genetic, it's in our willingness to learn and teach. Our curiosity does fade a bit with age, and our knowledge is challenged by a UI revamp, but our attitude towards software, usability, and conveying that to the grunts is what pays the mortgage in the end.

[ChrisBradley]

Both my wife and I hate the new ribbon. She is an Excel expert working in human resources (compensation & benefits) and I'm the Word expert for documentation. I can't stand all the extra mouse clicks to do things that have always been available front and center, and she hates having to hunt and peck her way through the ribbon as well. I would hate it if Flare went the way of the ribbon, I much prefer it as it is today.

I understand that Microsoft was trying to make an interface more usable to the masses, but I feel like they screwed over the experts. I personally believe they should have got rid of Microsoft Works and made an Office Basic (with the new Ribbon) and left Office Professional alone.

[Andrew]

The best way to mitigate the ribbon hunt-n-peck (I had the same issue) is to add all of your most commonly-used tools to the Shortcut bar. They are much easier to access that way -- even with very simple keyboard shortcuts. On the bad side, the icons are very small and often hard to recognize, but muscle memory quickly takes over.

[KevinDAmery]

The best way to mitigate the ribbon hunt-n-peck (I had the same issue) is to add all of your most commonly-used tools to the Shortcut bar. They are much easier to access that way -- even with very simple keyboard shortcuts. On the bad side, the icons are very small and often hard to recognize, but muscle memory quickly takes over.

In other words, pretend the ribbon isn't there and build your own toolbar? (sorta like you would in Office 2003?)

[lacastle]

In other words, pretend the ribbon isn't there and build your own toolbar? (sorta like you would in Office 2003?)

In that case, you can double click on the ribbon (names of the tabs) and minimize it so you really forget it's there!

[Andrew]

In other words, pretend the ribbon isn't there and build your own toolbar? (sorta like you would in Office 2003?)

Sort of. It depends on what you do with Word, I suppose. I just leave the stuff in the Home tab there, and then start adding the features that I had to often hunt-n-peck through tabs for to the Shortcut bar. They tried to organize each button/tool by where you would most likely need it (i.e, make it more task-oriented), but I think they largely failed. Not so much due to poor effort; but rather due to the extremely wide range of usage we make of various functions. What works for one person isn't going to work for everyone. Which is why I've said above that lack of customization is its weakest point. I'd sort of like to see a different shortcut bar depending on which tab I'm in, as well...though that might get a bit too complicated for many.

Bear in mind, the ribbon is not *only* the arrangement of the tools on tabs. It is also the "toolification" of many buttons (i.e., you don't just click a button and it does something, or brings up a dialog...the buttons often open a mini-tool that enables you to very quickly make some changes). While this toolification (heh, what a word) isn't completely new to the ribbon, it seems to be far better utilized.

[RamonS]

But in the end you click your own tool and menu bars together....and given some time it probably looks like the old menus less the useless stuff that clogs Word for no reason. Even more reason not to even add a ribbon.